Jacq's Logging Project Discussion

[marc_reusser]

Jacq,

I believe the sierra west staionary boiler would be too small (from what I can recall about the SW boiler). In the photos aboce, I believe the sepia toned image is from a california sawmill (it was on ebay with a bunch of other california logging photos)...so this is about the size and type you would want for your mill.

Have a rare CHB kit that makes a sim boiler to the one in the lower right of the catalog page......I will take some photos of the parts for you......I think some of the parts would be useful to you if you wanted to try and recast them (especially some like the smokebox end with boiler to stack transition....and maybe one or two other parts....the rest you could easily fabricate from styrene to maybe better approximate the sepia image boiler end.

For pipe fittings and such:  I believe Wetsern Scale sells a box of only pipe fittings (not sure)....or if not, he's a nice guy, and might make up a bag of them for you if you asked (Russ knows him well). They are white metal, and some do require a bit of cleaning at the seam lines.  Grandt really only makes the small (1.5 to 3cm proto dia) lines and fittings for brake rigging under RR cars....but they do come in useful for many of the lines.....these are plastic, and do require some fiddeling with to correct the flash, and often badly offset seam lines....I generally try toi use only the elbows, joints, t's and valves, and use brass or .020-025 styrene for the lines themselves.  PSC makes a good amount of fittings for their locos ...so there are a number of sizes, shapes, valves, etc to choose from......If you have their On3 Loco Supplies catalog, they should be in there......However....I have never been a fan of their brass castings (the plastic are better).....I feel they are often times crude, deformed, heavy on the seam lines, roughly cast, off-set at the seams etc....and require a lot of cleaning and rework....but they are pretty much the only game in town for some of the parts needed.

Some items like pipe flanges at mounting points or joints, can be made using the punch & die sets from Waldron, and from Micro-Mark.........I recommend buying both (The Waldron "sub miniature" set, and the Micro Mark one)as they are all different sizes, and allow for more range/flexibility.


Marc

[jacq01]

Marc,

the Sierra West boiler is too small.
The CHB horizontal brick boiler has my interest, particullary when it has  parts.
The Western Scale horizontal brick boiler measures 4.5"x 2.0"x2.5" but the boiler and brick encasing is in O scale one single hydrocal casting and not useable for my plans.
The punch and die sets are definite on my list. I now use a hole punch for belts etc.   results are not spectacular but usable (H0)
I'll contact Bill Gustavson or he can supply me with usable pipe fittings etc. to do the steam lines to the cilinders of the logdeck equipment and the boiler and power house. The mill equipment ( bandsaw, carriage parts and pulleys)  and a lot of tools for the workshop are from Western Scale.


Jacq

[jacq01]

Marc,

sorry to read about the closure of "steaminthewoods" and consequentely the controversy about the origin of images.     I spend a lot of happy hours with it.
First reaction was:  there goes the main reference for my logging project.

I hope it is not affecting the information stream here on the forum and with this topic.

Have a rare CHB kit that makes a sim boiler to the one in the lower right of the catalog page......I will take some photos of the parts for you......I think some of the parts would be useful to you if you wanted to try and recast them (especially some like the smokebox end with boiler to stack transition....and maybe one or two other parts....the rest you could easily fabricate from styrene to maybe better approximate the sepia image boiler end.

This will definitely help to detail the interior of the boiler house.

Here some progress:
The carriage way is in place, the rails still need to be spiked/bolted
The steam cilinder is ready to be installed.
The resaw is making good progress.

Innitally I build up the second Western Scale bandsaw and intended to use it as a resaw.
Than I noticed from several sources that resaws were normally smaller in diameter than the headsaw.
At a certain moment the matter bothered me to such an extend that I took the second model apart and rebuilt it to suit a smaller wheel variant.




  A comparison between the 10'0" rim and the 8'0" built wheel.




  The Wheel is built up as a laminate from 0,25mm x 3,2mm styrene strips around a glass bottle with an OD of
  48,2mm ( one needs some luck sometime  ) This gives with 4 layers a final diameter of 50,2mm ( 2")
  or 8'0" in 1/4 scale.  The final layer is 0,13mm thick and covers the holes drilled for the spokes.



 
  Detail showing the laminate built up. Each time the correct diameter was determined and the joints staggerd in relation to the previous layer.



  Wheel and modified base on top of a patent drawing of a resaw guide and feed. This part is currently under construction.




A comparisson of the bandwheels with sawblade in place. I reduced the width of the 15" blade to 8".
The lower wheel, drive pulley, lower sawband part and bearings will be made as a separate part to facilitate assembly in the mill building.



The carriage tracks are in place. To position allign and keep them in place to glue, caused a lot of "not so nice"  words.
Nails / bolts still to be done. Steamcilinder also fits in place.
Amazing that the carriage is moving all the way   


It is not going as fast as I intended as the delivery of ordered materials is NOT making any progress, I am waiting already more than 4 weeks for scale lumber, pulleys bearings and a large batch of Evergreen stuff.
I have started playing around with the geografics of the module and the foundations of the buildings.

Jacq

[finescalerr]

The smaller band saw is a work of art and a meticulous, precise replica. I am very, very impressed. -- Russ

[marc_reusser]

Jacq,

I have had this issue with this gentleman for some years. There were 20 or so images that were his, and were posted with proper credits and his approval (did a rough count when this came up last time with him).....as far as the claiming that there are others I am using some without credit....... he never has pointed out which image(s) he feels are in question....rather just makes a blanket statement.  We have been competeing collectors for images in the past. We clearly own many of the same images... between his (he notes as having a collection of 200,000 or such) and mine there is bound to be overlap (especially since many old images were often printed in multiples and then sold/distributed). Had he actually pointed the individual image(s) in question, we could have resolded this easily/quickly....he never has....until then we will likely continue to disagree. 

No it will not affect my assistace/contribution to this project or others that can benefit. Though all new images posted will at the very least be heavily watermarked.


Your Bandsaw is just superb! ...truely beautiful work. Thanks for the SBS on how you ent about it...very helpful.



Marc

[Chuck Doan]

Beautiful work, Jacq! THat wheel is amazing. You are very brave.

[TRAINS1941]

Jacq

Just outstanding, a perfect wheel.  Not to mention the rest of the saw.

Jerry

[lab-dad]

Great information, I love hearing how other "cobble" things together.
Thanks for sharing Jacq.
Did you do the spoke placement on a rotary table or lathe?

I've seen the original one, it's a big S.O.B!
-Marty

[danpickard]

Jacq,
Very nice modification of the smaller wheel, good patience with the spoke work and great colouring of the machinery...good used but not abused tones!  Getting back to the decking boards issues of previous posts, I was visiting my brother-in-laws sawmill that he owns (in the Otway Ranges of Victoria, Australia).  His mill is very much a restoration work in progress, with plans to oneday run it as something like a educationthing/museum style attraction for school groups etc.  Its built on the side of the hill and previously had no flooring as such, just the dirt slope to work on, so he has dug in various levels (by hand mind you!) and started to deck in various work platforms.  Interestingly, but probably more due to his lazy construction nature of "that fits so I'll use that piece", he has done much of the decking similar to yours, mostly unstaggered using plenty of recycled timbers from elsewhere in the mill.  A few deck areas had a bit of an uncomfortable degree of bounce in them, but he assures me he thinks they will be "safe" because he knows which ones are a bit soft!!!

Dan

[jacq01]

  Marty,

  the wheel was spoked on a discarded piece of plywood. Firstly a circle of 2" was drawn, a sheet of clear overhead projector sheet was pinned to it and a hole drilled in the centre to take the wider boss. The rim was than glued on 4-5 points to the sheet with PVA glue to keep it in place relative to the boss. The holes in rim and the boss ( already drilled  0,6mm ) were alligned with 0,5mm spokes every 90° and when all lined out correctly glued with CA. Than a bottle of beer was opened and......the rest of the spokes were added alternating ( the same procedure as spoking a bicycle wheel ) When all were in place and the glue dry, the wheel was removed from the sheet and the protruding spokes cut and filed. A 0,13mm thick strip was added on the circumference to hide the spoke ends.

Did you do the spoke placement on a rotary table or lathe?

I am, by choice, a sort of a kitchentable modeler. I have a very good quality basic set of tools like rulers, small drills, soldering iron, files ( plenty of them) etc etc.  Electric tools are 2-3 small drill units ( Proxxon and Dremel) and recently a 6" sanding disk with variable speed ( min 250 rpm)  A drill stand with movable table is in the planning.  All drawing work by hand, no more CAD work ( used  Catia IV and V, Unigraphics, Pro-Engineer and Autocad)  It has become a sport to find simple constructions and solutions with basic materials.

So cobbling things together might be the right word 

Most important: I am gratefull to have a good eye for dimensions and noticing, maybe better said sensing, very small deviations and very stable hands.

I am able to see a deviation of less than 1 - 1,5 mm on the gap between a carbumper and surrounding parts or the gap/flush of a cardoor some 20 - 30 m away from me.  My wife has forbidden me to point out such items when travelling together in the car.

When starting my career as MSc some 37 years ago, the first 6 months I worked in the 1:10 drawing office to learn drawning ships lines and parts 1:10 with a 0,1 pen, with an indication what the measure side of the line was.  Here 1:10 templates were produces for the optical system of cutting and bending machines of 1:1 parts.
After that I worked in the assembly workshop for 8 months to get the feel of assembly, welding, milling with small to very large milling machines, casting small and large parts ( 15'0" propellor blades) and work on the slipway and drydock "feeling" how al those small and large parts became a ship, before I was allowed to start on my job in the design office.  This unique experience to be able to learn what challenges and decisions mean forms the base of my approach to all projects I have been involved in. 


Dan,
the board ends coincide with the larger 12" joists and they feel very stable .   
I dunno when I have put in the nails    ???


Any suggestion on simulating the nails in the floor boards. I recall some remarks from Chuck regarding nail imitations in 1/4 scale.

Jacq

[Chuck Doan]

I would consider a 0.3 mm drafting pencil. I have tried .008 wire in .008 holes, but I don't know how masochistic you are!

[marc_reusser]

Jacq,

I am pretty anti nailhole...unless they are done with the subtleness and skill that Chuck does them....so my recommendation if would be not to make them too deep...merely a slight indentation....because remeber...in real life these are not nail "holes"...but rather nail "heads".....and most nail heads are either flush or at most slightly below the line of the wood surface.....or sticking up from the surface (especially on walls where there is a lot of board expansion and contraction from natural drying, and the climate.

....maybe Chuck can chime in on this....but if using the .3mm pencil lead (which is a good recommend.), you could always sligtly touch the end of the lead in a dark grey-black/red-brown oilbase color prior to making the impression...this will give the dark indication of a nail head....and if touched with some turpentine will cause the paint/color to seep/bleed along the grain & around the head...discoloring the boards sim to what happens in real wood. This though needs to be done subtley or in moderation otherwise the thing could end up looking like a Leopard. How much paint, the color and the varying effect acheived with different turp amounts should be experimented with first.


Just my two cents....


Marc

[RoughboyModelworks]

Jacq:

I have to agree with Marc and Chuck on the nailholes and nailheads. You have to remember that from a prototype viewing distance, looking at a prototype structure, nailheads generally aren't visible, unless the heads are 1" dia. or bigger! Whatever you do, make it subtle and minimal. I've seen a lot of models ruined by overzealous nailhead treatment.

Paul

[finescalerr]

By coincidence I used a pencil to create nailheads on my last model. I was careful to avoid creating an indentation; I just made a very small, pretty subtle dot. Each is invisible from more than a few inches away and not very obvious from a closer distance. They were among the few details I was happy with. -- Russ

[chester]

I agree, I've always thought nail heads were often overdone, especially in smaller scales.