Jacq's Logging Project Discussion

[Frederic Testard]

Take care, Jacq.

[jacq01]

  Little update ( also partly  published as an answer to Dan Pickard in his Gum Tree topic)

   with the daily physio excercises my thumb is slowly returning to it's normal abilities.
   I feel youg again as sucking on it gives lots of deja vu feelings. 
  It is still a delicate balance and a new experience of living with the limitations.
  The pink will take much longer, if ever, to regain the sense of "fabric" touch again. Touching an object I sense, but do not feel the sort of material and
  surface status, like smooth, wet, warm, wood or steel, etc.... Typing with one hand was a bit slow and turned out a very good excersise in patience...

   Modeling is luckily possible again and last night I enjoyed working more than three hours on a new set of disconnects. I only experienced some problems with my new
   resistance soldering unit, which is being sorted out by the manufacturer. Very good service communication, but annoying as I want to finish my 16 ton PSC shay
   before the next show. I'll show progres when I can work on it again. I have re-gauged the wheels already to On30 together with machining the truck bolsters for the
   correct sideframe spacing.
  Tonight I get help setting up the landscape modules in the workshop so I can start finalising the next couple of weeks a lot of items for an exclusive serie of photographs for Russ.
  Progress photo's for the forum will not be forgotten.

  The good feeling for modeling is back, that is the greatest improvement. 

   
  Jacq

[marc_reusser]

Good to hear that things are improving and you are able to model again. I look forward to your progress.

Are these the Echo Mtn. disconnects that you are rredoing the bolsters on?


M

[jacq01]

    Marc,

    the only change with Echo Mountain disconnects will be replacing the On3 wheelsets by FWM On30 wheelsets.

    The machined bolsters are part of the trucks for the PSC 16t 2cyl. Shay. The trucks are changed from On3 to On30.
    When controling the cylinder castings, I discovered a missalignment that makes it impossible to get the crankshaft in the three bearings.
    I have contacted PSC or a replacement is available.
   
    The layout is built up and after some unexpected repairs  everything functions again. 

    As the PSC disconnects did not behave as expected, modifications have been carried out to make them roll, stay on the track and do not jump when unloading.
    The bearing springs were removed and the bearings with axles fixed in place with the car on a level piece of track. The height reduction also works in favor of the unloading stability.
    4 cars done, now the other 16. The FWM wheelsets are definitely an improvement.   In total there are now enough sets disconnects and other wagons to have some challenging shunting.

     

    more photo's will follow soon   

   

    Jacq

[lab-dad]

I would enjoy seeing/hearing more about the Shay and the disconnects.
Congrats on the layout! Stunning comes to mind.
-Marty

[Ray Dunakin]

I like that photo, being able to see the whole thing at once plus a 1:1 scale human for reference.  The mill is huge!

[jacq01]

  Marty,

  the shay is on hold due to the following :

 

 

 

  the cilinders in the casting do not line up.  On the top this looks a minor problem, but the offset is such that the bearings on the bottom do not line up.  The misallignment is so large that filing is not possible.  The crankshaft appear to be cut very short on one side to allow for a proper cleaning and aligning.
I contacted PSC for a replacement, but (as usual) no reply  my mail.

  the disconnects:

 

  the last of the 20 cars.......  axle fixures were made by a good friend to enable easy soldering.  These are nice cars but the castings needed a lot of attention.  The wheelsets were replaced with FWM On30 wheelsets. Advantage : no more short circuits due to singe wheel insulation. Disavantage: colour of wheels and weak adhering of the paint. 
Another problem was the bearing box springs. Far too stiff so the axle allignment was determined by the exact soldering of the closing strip at the bottom. When unloading logs the wagons jumped the rails constantly.    Solution : leave the springs out    I inserted a small shim between the frame and bearing box, alligned all wheels with the car on level track and glass plate and glued everthing in place. Result: good rolling car and stable when unloading logs. 



 





the first effort with my resistance soldering unit. The unit suffered a technical breakdown and American Beauty is sending a replacement unit.

 

test fit of 6" x 2" deckplanking. Planks to be cleaned, treated with silverwood ready to be glued down after painting.



The logdump:
 


unloading chain in rest position.



chain in unloading position



log ready to be dumped



log moving on car



log rolling into the pond



chain returning in rest position so next car can be moved in place.

a readable drawing explaining the mechanism will follow.

Jacq
   

[lab-dad]

excellent information!
Love the dumping sequence photos, the figure is perfect too!
Man do you have bad luck with stuff from the sates!
Thanks!
-Marty

[marc_reusser]

Sorry to see you having so much bad luck....but I feel even worse for what am about to tell you......
The log car you assembled looks very strange..insofar as the construction.....I have no idea where the mfr got this car design from, but it is in several ways:

1. The bolster seems undersized compared to what is typically seen on these types of cars (this is where all the direct bearing weight occured on these, and they were typically larger in dimension.

2. There would typically be a beam that ran from the end sill, and centered on the coupler pocket, to the bolster, on both sides. There would be tie rods that ran the length of the car (through the bolster) from coupler pocket bolt to coupler pocket bolt (or if not directly from the pocket, then from a heavy steel plate that was mounted behind the pocket. These two things handled the tension and compression of the cars when in use.

3.  I have never seen the decking mounted inside the strap detail like that. Generally it extended to the outside of the side sills, nailing/fastening seems tenuous at best with your approach.....but I have seen a couple instances where there was a rabbet in the inside of the side sill to drop/set the decking into (typically on European cars), and photos where there appear to be "ledgers" on the inside of the side sills that set the decking down a bit from the top....this acted as a quasi tray, where the loose log chains and such could be laid when the cars were empty. (also have seen an example of where one car in a pair of disconnects had a wooden tray built on one end for this purpose.)


Marc

[jacq01]

   

Man do you have bad luck with stuff from the states!

     apperently.        

    A large plus however, the communication and service of American Beauty is outstanding !!

    Marc, 
   
    the cars are advertised in the PSC catalogue no 5 ( page 50)  including a sketch showing how to apply 6"x 2" decking.
    The cars appear similar to the ones advertised by Keith Wiseman. 
    With my believe at that time, the models from these manufacturers are based on "originals" I bought a number of sets at the start of the logging project.

    The cars in use at the moment on the layout are by Model Works from New Zealand.
    They are easy to built ( glue or solder), have a good weight, track well and are conform On30 recommendation for couplers etc.
    The Echo Mountain sets are under construction. The brass casting quality is superior to PSC.
     
    Any further info for disconnects or correct skeletons is welcome

    Jacq
     
   

   

[Philip Smith]

I'm experiencing a red x.... today and yesterday with the last set of photos...Hmmmm

Philip

[TRAINS1941]

Jacq

Some great pictures of the layout.  Excellent work!!

Jerry

[marc_reusser]

Jacq,

IMO Keith Weisman doesn't know sh*t-from-shinola when it comes to logging. As far as I know he is merely a saleperson/mfr that buys defunct company molds and parts, and then sells, casts, or recasts them.


I will pull some reference material for you on the disconnects and post it.


M

[artizen]

Something like this for logging loads?

http://www.buntbahn.de/modellbau/viewtopic.php?t=9749&start=10

Scroll down about two thirds for images.

[jacq01]

  Ian, 
  thanks for that On30 conspiracy or caricaturistic tip .  That has little to do with aiming for correct models.

  If had believed in the beginning some 2,5 years ago on another forum all the " expert" advice on sawmill construction, this layout would never have been created.

  For the logging rolling stock I believed the american modeling industry was offering "correct" material, but ala it is not to be.
  In that respect it is a pity that, for very valid reasons, the biggest reference site  "Steam in the Woods" dissappeared and copies of authentic plans for logging cars are scarce.
  Many manufacturers or builders hide behind the " build as you want as there are plenty of deviations" but few do offer models after real samples or with too many simplifications.   

  For me it means back to basics and start with an investigation into the construction of logging cars like disconnects and skeleton cars and built them myself like I did with most of the mill's machinery. Maybe the brass frames of the PSC disconnects are usable after extensive rework, some experiments will tell.
The locomotives do pass my standards, even when repairs on all the B'mann loco's where needed on driveline parts.   The best investment in rolling material has been so far the Shay by Bernard.

Marc,  I do have the Kemtron set with plans of logging cars. How good are these ?  Are pe. the Mc Leods Russel archbar trucks usable ?

a Happy Newyear.

  Jacq